What happens when Autumn and Jesper lets go of the reigns and come up with the most crazy and stupid ways in which to create fictional characters?

Episode 115 is NOT designed to give you any writing advice. Hopefully, it'll make you laugh instead.

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Read the full transcript below.

(Please note that it's automatically generated and while the AI is super cool, it isn't perfect. There may be misspellings or incorrect words on occasion).

Narrator (2s):
You're listening to the Am Writing Fantasy podcast. In today's publishing landscape, you can reach fans all over the world. Query letters are a thing of the past. You don't even need an literary agent. There is nothing standing in the way of making a living from writing. Join two best selling authors who have self published more than 20 books between them now onto the show with your hosts, Autumn Birt and Jesper Schmidt.

Jesper (30s):
Hello, I am Jesper

Autumn (31s):
And I'm Autumn.

Jesper (33s):
This is episode 115 of the Am Writing Fantasy podcast. And this is one more of our lighthearted episodes. We will share 10 terrible ways of creating characters. So I'm really looking forward to hear what you came up with here. Autumn.

Autumn (50s):
Yeah, it was good. It was a challenge and it was fun because there was times I was like, Oh, I might try that. But yeah, we'll see how it goes. And I actually, since we're doing 10, I assumed this is an alternating list. So I only needed to come up with five, but I came up with a couple of extra just in case you chose ones. I well, just in case you already chose one that way I, I, I could still put in an entry to win this one.

Jesper (1m 16s):
Damn that's well-prepared I didn't have to think about that.

Autumn (1m 19s):
I did my homework and I did extra homework. So HA, I already won.

Jesper (1m 25s):
Well, no, that I don't agree. Let's see, because you might have some mediocre bonus ones, but that doesn't trump. My very good ones.

Autumn (1m 35s):
Oh, we'll see. Challenge accepted. We will check this out, but it's the, how are things over on your side of the Atlantic?

Jesper (1m 45s):
It's it's good. Just writing, taking care of job stuff, you know? Right. But I also, I actually finished reading the Name of the Wind by Patrick Rothfuss. Oh, I finished reading it this weekend.

Autumn (2m 1s):
That, that book it's I hear so much about it. Like I recognize his name everywhere and it's, I have not read it yet myself, but I'm like, wow, it's just like, it's already got this known mythos. So how was it?

Jesper (2m 14s):
That was exactly why I bought it and read it because of all the praise it gets. So I thought, okay, I better read this one and figure out what's the, what is all the fuss about? Yeah. And I must have, I must say that I understand why he's getting so much praise for his writing. The writing itself is really well done. Oh, excellent. Really, really nice writing. And you, you get, you get so much into the characters. So that is very well done. I'm actually planning to share a bit more in our readers group on Facebook. A bit more my thoughts on it, but I also small, not spoiler for the book, but small spoiler for my opinions that I'm going to share on the readers group on Facebook is that I am missing a bit of action.

Autumn (2m 59s):

Jesper (3m 0s):
I'm missing a bit that something happening actually. I mean, there is something happening here and there, but it is also a lot about just a character and, you know, basically like how the character grows into becoming the person that he is. And the entire book is more or less flashback. So it's basically the main character is telling like a scribe who is then sitting down, writing down he story and it stops from his childhood. And then how he sort of grows into becoming what he is. So I'm not going to spoil anything of course here, but, but it is basically like a very, very slow long flashback with some chapters here and there where you in the present.

Jesper (3m 47s):
But very few. So that also means that a lot of the lot of the story actually is more or less about him growing up stuff, which character wise is extremely well done. It extremely well-written. So, so that is good, but I would really like a bit more action. I definitely my writing and reading definitely gravitates towards more action. Like I want characters I care about, but I want to see them doing things so interesting. I I've been thinking a bit picking it up. So I'll, I look forward to your review and don't forget to review it on good reads. Since you did join, it's a good tool to use, is it?

Jesper (4m 30s):
Yeah, I have to do that as well. I was thinking, well, maybe we're going to set up at some point here in the near future. Not quite sure when, but we'll probably let people know, but we were going to set up a group on good reads. So once we get that going, I will post videos, I think in that group about and stuff like this. So I am going to share, but I don't know if I want to get into all the reviewing officially kind of thing on good reads. I'm not sure I want to do that, but also I don't, I don't like, you know, well, one author reviewing other authors it's feels like a bit like, Hmm. I'm not sure that's a good idea.

Autumn (5m 12s):
We can be overly nice or overly critical of other authors. I will say that it's kind of hard. There's no, in-between because we're never just reader as we're reading it for looking at what we like, what we don't like. Well, the flaws we see and it's definitely, I've noticed authors when they review other authors work. Sometimes it can be just all you worked so hard on this. Good for you. And other ones are like, wow, if this was my story. So it's night and it's night and day. It's really funny. Yeah. And the thing is that it's all subjective. Right? So just because I think I would like more action doesn't mean that there isn't a million people out there who thinks it's the best book they ever read.

Jesper (5m 53s):
Right. And I don't want to sort of get into that crossfire there. It's just like, it's just my opinion. And I, I, you know, I'm entitled to that. Like everybody else's entitled to theirs, we don't have to have a fight about it. But once you start posting official reviews about it, then you risk having a fight about it. And I'm not sure I want to do that. So sure enough, a private group is slightly different in terms of just sharing some thoughts about it. That's slightly different than, than an official written review. I think which stars on it and all that. But I don't know. I'm a pot from a sort of jinxing, our podcast distribution, and also breaking that one. Autumn.

Jesper (6m 33s):
I don't know what else you've been up to. I'm trying not to break things.

Autumn (6m 39s):
I swear, but yeah. Okay. So the podcast distribution got a little delayed because I touched something on the website and seemed to broke something again, but I'm breaking things less frequently. It's going to end sooner if this can keep going, you know, with your breaking, everything you touch. And especially because this wouldn't when this episode is released next Sunday, the coming Sunday in less than like six days from when this is released, my next book, the tainted phase series is being released. And I'm so excited. So hopefully I don't break em. So I, when I upload it, it's my God.

Jesper (7m 20s):
I can just see the uproar. Like every author starts panicking. KDP is down. KDP is down. It's like, Autumn! Did you upload anything?

Autumn (7m 31s):
Yeah, that'll be me. But hopefully I've just excited to get this one out the door. I love what I've been hearing from the ARC reader. So I'm really, I just cannot wait to share this one with the world.

Jesper (7m 42s):
Yeah. And it, and by the way, if anybody got confused about what we were talking about with the podcast distribution data, just to let the reader know, well, by the time this airs it's been a few weeks, actually. So maybe you don't even remember, maybe you didn't notice, but some might have noticed how episode 112 only appeared in your feed. Like several days after the Monday, it was supposed to get distributed. And I'm not going to mention why that was and who touched something. But yeah, you might know.

Autumn (8m 17s):
Just, I swear, I need to come with a little note that says maybe a jinx, just a little note, don't do this shit at home. That's my, that'll be my life motto.

Narrator (8m 30s):
A week on the internet with the Am Writing Fantasy podcast.

Jesper (8m 36s):
So we have something very special to mention today. We don't do this very often, but once in a while we just love offering something extra, something special for our patron supporters.

Autumn (8m 49s):
Yes. And I'm so excited that there's so much stuff going on in March. We just had the guide course I a book coming out in a week and we're doing something very special over on Patrion.

Jesper (9m 2s):
Yeah. We have a special giveaway, but it won't be open for long. So we're going to close it again on the 22nd of March. So this will apply to all existing patrons supporters as well as everyone who signs up before the 22nd of March.

Autumn (9m 20s):
Yes. So definitely come and join us. And we are giving everyone who joins or is already a member there, a copy of our plot development book, because we think everyone should feel special. And that's just the type of people. You are a cast. We over-give, we overshare. I don't know.

Jesper (9m 41s):
Yeah. So everyone is going to get that. And then in addition, we are going to do a draw and one lucky winner is gonna win a mentor session with autumn and myself. And all of those extra prizes of course comes on top of the stuff that you will get normally

Autumn (10m 1s):
Patron. Yes that's. Oh, and there's different tiers. And there's already cool things with every single one. I mean, it starts at a dollar a month. So you get something instantly for just a buck, which is fantastic. Plus you get a chance to win. Plus you get a chance to you go ahead and you get the plot development book, which has gotten so many praises. So that's fantastic. And even has some extra things you can get for free in it. So we just keep giving things away. It's a very interesting bottle we've got going on there.

Jesper (10m 31s):
Yeah. I don't know business wise how smart that is, but

Autumn (10m 38s):

Jesper (10m 38s):
I mean, there's never been a better time to sign up, to support the am writing fantasy than right now to him. And as always, you will find the link in the show notes.

Autumn (10m 54s):

Jesper (10m 54s):
So this should be fun. I'm actually, I like these alternating lists episodes there. Yeah.

Autumn (10m 59s):
It wasn't fun. It brings out your competitive spirit, which I've noticed you're a high competitor. So this will be, it'll be interesting.

Jesper (11m 8s):
Yeah. You know, I figured out the one thing I am missing. Yeah. Normally when I'm a referee, I have my yellow and red carts. I feel like I should have that here as well.

Autumn (11m 18s):
So that if you're not behaving,

Jesper (11m 19s):
I can give you a red caught and put you into sin bin and stuff.

Autumn (11m 23s):
Yeah. Yeah. I'll just touch the computer and the entire thing will explode. So watch it.

Jesper (11m 33s):
Absolutely glad that I'm the one doing the controls of the podcast here, because otherwise you probably would stop recording or something all over.

Autumn (11m 40s):
I am so afraid to touch my computer. Right.

Jesper (11m 44s):
Yeah. Please don't touch anything. Just speak into the mic without touching them.

Autumn (11m 51s):
No, this is difficult. All right. But what if my goes to sleep? That could be its own problem. Anyway, we won't go that way. No.

Jesper (12m 0s):
Okay. So I think we have five each and you have a few bonus ones. And then of course we should at the end, try to figure out which one is the worst of the worst stern. And it would make most sense if it's probably one of mine. So if anybody gets, you know, well, if you just want to skip to the end of the episode, you can listen to us concluding that one of mine was the best one.

Autumn (12m 28s):
Well, why, what does it earn that you have to earn that? Sorry. And no freebies here. Well only freebies to listeners and other authors. No freebies to us. Sorry.

Jesper (12m 39s):
Okay. Well, let's go through the motion then if you insist, it's not going to change the outcome.

Autumn (12m 45s):
So do I see, I had a hard time differentiating with mine. I don't know which one's worse or what, so mine's slightly a random order, but we'll go for it. Okay.

Jesper (12m 56s):
Yeah. Yeah. I, well, I guess most of mine could be in a different orders. Well, I did try to make number one. Like that's probably the worst one I could think of, but if you want to upload up one of the other ones, that's okay with me as well. So you can do that.

Autumn (13m 12s):
All right. Sounds good. So who wants to go first? We have to flip a coin or shall I graciously allow you to, to start? Since you believe yours are already better.

Jesper (13m 23s):
Okay. Yeah. You okay? Yeah. I understand. You want to get right into the good stuff. You know, normally when I eat candies and stuff like that, I sh I saved the good ones for last, because that's how I prefer to do it. But if you want to get straight to the favorite ones, then yeah. Let's let's do.

Autumn (13m 38s):
Yeah. Put your cards on the table. Let's see.

Jesper (13m 42s):
Oh, I'm jinxing myself so bad. Now I know

Autumn (13m 49s):
A bluffer.

Jesper (13m 51s):
Yeah. Yeah. So I'm number five. So this one is sticking to archetypes, you know, like sticking to archetypes. So this is the, you, you make the mentor, the one who gives the advice and you make sure that this is all that character does. The hero does all the heroic stuff. And the love interest has an over abundance of love, no matter how badly he or she is actually

Autumn (14m 26s):
Treated. Oh, so you basically

Jesper (14m 28s):
Don't give a crap about adding more layers to the character. Just, you just want archetypes and then you might be thinking, well, Derrida, you like archetype. So I'm going to give them to you. Who cares about cultures or skin color and Oh my God, personality trait, all that nonsense. I tell you, it's just a waste of time to worry about testings. I,

Autumn (14m 53s):
I liked that one. And actually I have to admit that is actually one of the bonus ones I came up with was basically don't create your characters at all. Just make them all stereotypes with virtually no personality. And I think Conan the barbarian, he is the hero's hero and so boring. So have you ever read Kona that pop area? I actually have not. I just remember it from the eighties and my childhood and watching it, watching my brother, what, you know, he was older than me. He would be running around being cornered.

Jesper (15m 25s):
Yeah. Yeah. But that's also the only way I've never read it either. I also only remember watching it on TV when I was a child or growing up and I just thought it was so cool.

Autumn (15m 41s):
I think at the time I, well, again, my brother was older and beating up on me cause he was Conan. So I had a different perspective. Well, yeah, I can see that. All right. Yes. So you're ready for my number five. Okay. Yes. All right. So just don't develop them at all. Use someone else's characters. So if you like Harry Potter, just create Barry Cotter, you know, just create something totally. A hundred percent based off of someone else's hard work. I think that's about the worst way I could think of creating a character.

Jesper (16m 17s):
Yeah. Okay. I might have something similar.

Autumn (16m 20s):
Oh, I'm not surprised because I'm going to say yeah.

Jesper (16m 24s):
Yeah. I was just going to say that must be because that's a pretty good idea too.

Autumn (16m 28s):
Exactly. And I said it first, so there you go. Okay.

Jesper (16m 35s):
Yeah. Actually that's not a good sign. If that was one of your bad ones, then I don't know if you have even better stuff coming. Yeah. Now I'm better word.

Autumn (16m 44s):
Good. Just where I want ya. Hmm. All right. So what's your number four number four. Yes. So this one is pure evil, intriguing, right? It sounds very intriguing.

Jesper (17m 2s):
The evil characters they do what they do because they are just asking

Autumn (17m 12s):
Readers who don't understand that ed it's.

Jesper (17m 16s):
Why should you even bother justifying that a characters actually flawed that the person has a trauma, which has distorted their worldview and that the couches is actually believing that he or she is doing what is necessary, even when it is in fact evil, evil, you know, that kind of thinking that's garbage. It is advice made up by authors who don't know what they're talking about and what yeah. Some of them might be successful.

Autumn (17m 45s):

Jesper (17m 46s):
Have you ever heard about catching lightning in a bottle? I guess not.

Autumn (17m 54s):
You know, there's something pure about just saying, well, he's evil, he's an asshole. This is how my character is. So we could go back to Cruella de Vil as evil characters. Sure. Yeah. That's just that's yeah.

Jesper (18m 12s):
No way to do an antagonist. It's just like, they're evil because they're evil. Okay, great. I like that. Wonderful. You really put a lot of thought into that one. Yeah.

Autumn (18m 26s):
Yeah. It would have me personally tearing my hair out because yeah. I like nuances. I like to love, especially me. I love to love my characters. I have a hard time letting them lose or Oh yeah.

Jesper (18m 41s):
Yeah. But that could be evil. There's nothing wrong with that. But there should be a reason for why they're doing what they're doing. They're not just doing it because it's fun to be evil. You know? That makes sense.

Autumn (18m 50s):
That's fun to be evil. That's like, I would love to give you that. I'll give you that. Actually I might be a super villain considering I destroy everything I touch. So, huh? No. I

Jesper (18m 60s):
Think we worked out that you were the Fe

Autumn (19m 3s):
That's true. Yes. Based on my forthcoming novel, the fake evil there's dark Fay. I wouldn't call them evil. They're just mischievous.

Jesper (19m 15s):
So that may be maybe your doc Phaidon

Autumn (19m 17s):
Might be dark. Hey. Oh, I feel outed. All right. Well, so my first one was, you know, just base your character on someone else's hard work, which is obviously you especially copyright issues and just, you should never undermine another author like that. You should never do it. So instead of basing them for my number four, instead of basing them all on someone else's characters, just based them all on you, a hundred percent, they're all just shades of you. I mean, why spend the time developing characters when you can just make them all you, when you know you, so you should be able to write the book. Isn't it? So that's my number four.

Autumn (19m 58s):
I think it's part. So basically

Jesper (20m 1s):
The characters have exactly the same traits and in dialogue, they all sound like you. Exactly the same. It's a wonderful book to read. It sounds really good.

Autumn (20m 11s):
Your mom and leg. Well, yeah, maybe. So that's plenty to find out if your siblings hate you or like you do, they like your book. Yeah.

Jesper (20m 28s):
Oh my God. Yeah. Just imagine the reviews, like from your own family members saying, I'm not sure. I quite liked the characters in this book is like what the it's me.

Autumn (20m 42s):
Oh yeah. So that's so there you go. I guess this is why you can never base your own characters on you because you might get really upset about what people say about them. So definitely take the time to develop your characters. You're running a massive risk. Are you going to take it personally because you should.

Jesper (20m 59s):
Yeah. All of a sudden the advice about not responding to one star reviews is going to be much more difficult to adhere to it.

Autumn (21m 9s):
Oh, okay. All right. Let's move on.

Jesper (21m 12s):
Why is the author so defensive about this? Karen? I don't get it.

Autumn (21m 18s):
Oh, I could be fun with it.

Jesper (21m 20s):
So number three is, well, we touched about on it slightly already. So this one, I called it being a lazy

Autumn (21m 28s):
Ass. I like this.

Jesper (21m 29s):
So some idiots could call it being smart, I guess if they're idiots, but this is basically, as you said, copying characters that you already know because

Autumn (21m 40s):
Readers love them. Right. So why would you want them?

Jesper (21m 43s):
You spend your time creating something on your own, you know, call Frodo, Modo Winstead. And he's not a habit, but he's at WARF. And maybe instead of bravery, you change that one trait into him being a wimp.

Autumn (21m 58s):
Otherwise he's exactly the same. Right? I don't see what's the problem. I, no, one's going to Sue you or point out that you basically copied someone else's work to create it out. You at least changed a couple of things on yours. Yeah,

Jesper (22m 15s):
The same. Yeah. He's called Modo. What's wrong with that. And he's a dwarf. He lives in a, in a place called hot-button, but, and maybe a slightly weird for it too.

Autumn (22m 29s):
But, and then he has a ring. I mean, I watch likes rings. Right. They liked jewelry sorta as the whole Hobbiton, you know, also had the, it was sorta cave. Like he just kind of emphasized that. Maybe call it Dorfan Tinder or something instead of Hobbiton Wolfington yeah. Yeah. I actually visited Harvard doing in real life. I know. I'm so jealous. I still have to get down to New Zealand. I want to go

Jesper (22m 56s):
To Gilda again. It's amazing.

Autumn (22m 58s):
Oh, Oh. Am writing fantasy work trip com. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh,

Jesper (23m 4s):
We could make a, and then we can record a podcast episode.

Autumn (23m 10s):
Oh, we have to find a way to do this. That would be awesome. That would be awesome to get back to this podcast and stop dreaming. But yeah. You know, your suggestion sounds vaguely familiar. Like someone else might've mentioned it a few minutes ago, so yeah.

Jesper (23m 29s):
I think maybe my spin on it was slightly, just slightly better.

Autumn (23m 38s):
You tried, you added something to it. I'm just saying. All right. So my number three is I was actually kind fun to find discover this, but there is a random character generator online. It's a UK based one. And so I, to any work you can go in there and just give me a character. And there's a few little inputs, so you can choose fantasy. You can choose hero. You can choose made, you can choose some things. And it pops out of character and Bing bang, boom, you're done. You're writing. Just go for it.

Jesper (24m 12s):
Did you try to run from, what does it generate? What is it?

Autumn (24m 16s):
I think it's like a little character sheet that, you know, almost like you would come up with some stuff like that. It gives you some traits and things too. So, you know, it comes up with some ideas, honestly, in some ways, if you, if you were truly having a hard time coming up with a story idea, I think you could possibly do this just for the fun of it. And maybe start creating a story around a character. But if you had a story in your mind and you just randomly, someone is like ripping a page out of a D and D book saying, this is my character and trying to force them into your story. I don't think it would work too well, but in its own, it was kind of like, Oh, this is, this could be actually fun.

Autumn (24m 57s):
It's like sitting there and rolling your dice to create a D and D character and seeing what you come up with.

Jesper (25m 4s):
I was almost thinking when you were saying that, that just as like a starting point, it might not be too bad an idea actually. You know, if, if you're sort of out of inspiration and what not to do, not not to use it, like it comes out of that generator, but more

Autumn (25m 21s):
Like just, just the starting

Jesper (25m 23s):
Frame of something. And then you can develop further on that.

Autumn (25m 27s):
Actually I have to admit, it was kind of like, I found it, I'm like, Oh, this could actually be fun because you might get ha you might get something you never would have considered before. So it's a bad idea, but it's also kind of a fun ideas. I saved the website. So yeah. If anyone wants to check it out, I mean, you can Google it, but it's just character, hyphen generator.org.uk. So shout out to them. I have never met anyone who works there or created it, but it was literally Googling it. It was the only, the only random character generator online. And it was kind of like, Oh, this is fun. This is actually really fun. So go check it out.

Autumn (26m 7s):
Yeah, no worries.

Jesper (26m 8s):
I was not aware of that one. That that's actually interesting. So yeah, when you don't know what to do in the evening, you can sit down in January.

Autumn (26m 21s):
This is what writers do during pandemics and lockdown. Yeah. So that's what you do when you're going in,

Jesper (26m 28s):
Going insane from COVID-19 and you'd just sitting dead. Any characters or,

Autumn (26m 33s):
Oh yeah. I've got an eye. I'm releasing a book. I'm busy. I'm good. I'm fine. Number two number,

Jesper (26m 41s):
But two we're getting there now. So, well, we all know that good stories are about characters, right? So you agree? I agree. I do agree. Okay. So what if the right is just love? Love, love, love, love, love me some characters. So why can't I just have a whole bunch of them. So they appear, and then they do their thing before they disappear, completely offering the States to 20 other characters that are equally doing death thing. And a then perhaps the guy from early in the book, he makes a surprise return during the climax and then whacks the bad guy over the head with a club.

Jesper (27m 28s):
Isn't that awesome.

Autumn (27m 31s):
Sure. Go ahead and write that up.

Jesper (27m 33s):
Well, who doesn't like characters? What do you mean? I don't get it. Everybody has characters. How many of

Autumn (27m 39s):
Them are point of view characters?

Jesper (27m 42s):
Well, all of them, they have their chapter each, right? So there's going to be 25 point of view characters and the yeah.

Autumn (27m 53s):
From different perspectives, I would guess. So probably a very confusing story. Oh, I had someone complained that I have like eight main characters in my fantasy trilogy.

Jesper (28m 5s):
I don't understand. I mean the more the merrier 35 point of view, it's probably never been done before. It's like a unique

Autumn (28m 12s):
I'm writing that I have to admit my mind is like, how can I organize this? This could actually work. It would be, it would be such an interesting challenge. I honestly think I need a writing intervention pitch and that I'm actually considering.

Jesper (28m 28s):
Yeah, you'll be surprised. Next time I send you a story for editing and it's got to be 35 characters and Yukon, a point of view character. And you're going to go back to be like, w

Autumn (28m 35s):
What is this? This is not what we agreed to.

Jesper (28m 42s):
It's just enriched the story. I made it better.

Autumn (28m 45s):
Why don't you get it? I don't get it. I can't imagine telling a cohesive. It reminds me, actually, this is a fun thing to actually do. But back when we could actually sit around a campfire with other living human beings, okay. And then someone would start a story and everyone would continue and carry it on. I loved of things like that. Being able to like just one person creates it and carry it on and see where you end up. That could be so much fun. I'm trying to imagine that in a narrative form, as an actual novel and through different characters, and I had had of worked out into a plot and I I'm, it's not clicking.

Autumn (29m 32s):
I'm sorry. I,

Jesper (29m 34s):
But you don't get it. This is just because it's a new level of writing. You just haven't advanced to that level yet. So you can't see it. It's just your,

Autumn (29m 45s):
It may be, it is. I will have to admit, I am not saying it, but I'll keep working on it and no way to you. Wait till you see there now next storyline. I hand you something to be afraid of.

Jesper (29m 60s):
Indeed. Now I can sleep tonight.

Autumn (30m 5s):
All right.

Jesper (30m 5s):
So what is number two,

Autumn (30m 8s):
Number two. That's where we're at. I got totally lost and trying to figure out how to plot a 35 point of view for this one. I thought taking it to your near and dear. So instead of basing the characters on yourself, or just randomly basing it on your friends and family, you should do a little bit of research here and ask your friends, your family, your roommates, your dorm hall, to take personality tests, and then use the results for characters. I think it could be fun that you could just base them all on people, you know, and the people you don't like you could accidentally kill off. It's very cathartic that

Jesper (30m 45s):
Way. And you're going to keep the names as well.

Autumn (30m 52s):
We arranged the letters, maybe a little bit. Steve could become that's or that's me Tebow. There's some options there. It's using real life techniques and real life people. Your characters should be feel real. What is more real than using, you know, people, you know, to create your characters. Yeah.

Jesper (31m 24s):
It was just what I was about to say, at least your characters will be complex and they will have depth that's for sure. But I think you might run a pretty big risk in getting very unpopular with certain people.

Autumn (31m 35s):
I might have to change the names a little bit, but yeah, I think Steven, you know, your coworkers, the ones you don't get along with my, pick it up. Maybe you don't have to put your boss in there. That's that's just like the worst idea. Don't be like, use your crush as the love interest. That's rewarding. Isn't that you can blog. Okay.

Jesper (32m 4s):
Or maybe they feel like you're a stalker or something discrete, or actually wrote it in a book as well.

Autumn (32m 12s):
But then if you break up, you can take care of that. Then this next book in this series, that's the next book in the series. I can see my dragon.

Jesper (32m 23s):
Nah, it sounds like it's going to be a very boring you. Well then the character went to grocery shopping and then got home. Did the dinner. It's just a really boring book about everyday life.

Autumn (32m 36s):
You need to change it to grocery shopping. That's getting supplies. So they could be going to the

Jesper (32m 42s):
Dragon at the shop.

Autumn (32m 44s):
Oh, you know those kids you'd never know. They could be a hoard of angry slobbery dwarves coming to attack you I'd be running, screaming

Jesper (32m 56s):
Behind the Friesa case. Came to 20 angry towards

Autumn (33m 3s):
Oh yeah. Hmm. Could work. Okay.

Jesper (33m 11s):
Okay. This one is gonna blow your mind.

Autumn (33m 13s):
I need let's go for it.

Jesper (33m 16s):
Yeah. Th this is definitely the winner. It's just like, doesn't get any better than this one. Number one, I tell you this one, I called make beep up. So a beep might be re B might be representing a word that starts with S

Autumn (33m 37s):
Okay. I could have beeped you for you, but all right. Seems fair. Okay. Okay.

Jesper (33m 44s):
So this is the attitude saying, I don't think it matters one bit what my character's motivations are or how about what their goals are. People are not complex at all. It's actually not that hard. You should just make up things as you go along. Character development, all that nonsense. It is something made up by stupid people who wants to sound smart, like the hosts of the Am Writing Fantasy podcast.

Autumn (34m 20s):
Hey, so, so yeah. No character arcs, nothing. You just,

Jesper (34m 24s):
No. No. Why do you need that?

Autumn (34m 29s):

Jesper (34m 30s):
Yeah, but I mean, you're making it too complicated. You just want some characters who go out and do crazy stuff, all kinds of things happening. The End. Right? It's a good story. You don't need all that. And then he was sad about blah, blah, blah. And all the touchy feelings. I mean, what do you don't need? All that. It's not, it's basically Conan the barbarian. Right? We just talked about how awesome it is.

Autumn (34m 56s):
Hey, I didn't get along with, I have a chip tooth from Conan. The barbarian I'll have, you know,

Jesper (35m 1s):
But you see how memorable it was. Huh? You still remembered because the chip tooth,

Autumn (35m 7s):
I had an emotional support. Yeah.

Jesper (35m 11s):
It's just much better. Instead of all this, a smarty pants, right? Advice about making a complex coaters no, just plain old Megadog as you go along. And if it, for example, suits the story, then all of a sudden the couch is a, is an angry villain who decides to do something really, really bad because it makes the more exciting

Autumn (35m 39s):
Than that's what happens. So it's kind of like a mad cap extravaganza. Just throw it out, make up stuff as you go. Right. That's the whole point of storytelling. It sounds in its own way. A fun way of writing, but odd. Hey, I honestly think I've read a few stories like this and I don't think I gave them a very high review. What? This just like sitting around the campfire and then somebody is telling a very, very good story. And I get you, you just remember how wonderful it was that summer evening when Steve or Steven was telling this, this really cool story.

Autumn (36m 20s):
And you still remember 20 years later, it's just like amazing. It's like the best of storytelling. This is exactly how to do it. I don't, yeah, this is the window for sure. But see if you can talk me then with your number one, I doubt it. But I have to admit, I don't think my number one is nearly as much fun as that one because I have to mix mine was I was trying to think of something random, kind of easy. And I happened to have been gifted a long time ago, this like four inch dictionary. That's leather bound and gold leaf. I mean, it's, it's gorgeous. It's a, it's a gorgeous dictionary. Even though like probably half the words have the butter day words are not even in it anymore.

Autumn (37m 3s):
It's old. But I was just thinking, you know what? You just flip that open, pick a word, do it again. And you pick out you don't 10 20 words and you make a character out of whatever random words you land on. Just okay. Yeah. Well, if, if it's a story about an insane, insane asylum, I think that will be fine. I think we'll see. You could, again, this is sort of like the random character generator. You could come up with something you never would have expected you land on like expeditious or study. Definitely grades. So I'm schizophrenia, lunatics. That's I, you know, I, I, it might work really well with your number one because they all sounded a little bit like, look at six, two B roll.

Autumn (37m 50s):
No, no, no, no. Not at all. I mean, my number one was about creating excitement and taking the story where we be following the story where it takes you. Right. That was my number one. And letting the characters completely different. Sure. Well, I'll just agree with you. I think I have to admit though, your number one, would I swear, I have read books like that, where the character just change from one chapter to the next. And I'm like, is this name on, is this the same name on a different character?

Autumn (38m 32s):
Maybe did it a sense of replacement made a mistake? I have wondered that at times I honestly have, Oh God. Yeah. Yeah. So what do you think I am actually, I have to, I hate to admit it, but I am still stuck on 35 point of view. Normal. It just kind of tickles me. I don't know why, but I actually have to admit, I kind of like your list. These are some really horrible ways of creating characters. What I, what do you mean horrible?

Autumn (39m 13s):
It's it's about following your muse, right? It's taking just follow the story. Don't give a shit about all those writing advice stuff, you know, go with the story goes. Yeah. Once you make me want to take my lap. Well, maybe not my laptop, a borrowed laptop, because I tend to destroy everything to a good bar, have a nice glass of scotch on the rocks and just start writing like a mad woman and see what comes out. Totally inspired me. I, I, I be grudgingly admit, I think you win this one. Yes. I said it in the beginning. And so it is true.

Autumn (39m 53s):
I, yeah. I think your character creation, you have totally devoted a authentic way of creating some really crazy characters. Oh. So you're telling me that winning this one actually means that I'm the worst. I'm not sure that this is not where I wanted it to go. Really? You should see the gold star I made for you. Damn. I don't want that. No. No. Okay. I think we need to get back to some more serious talk next week. This, this is, well, I make a point on my board, but I don't know. Maybe we actually, we should stop making a point board because I don't know.

Autumn (40m 36s):
I must be in delete though. I must be. You keep telling yourself that I think this one deck, this one deducts points from your board. So keep that in mind. No. Now I'll just end the podcast because this is getting too much now. Okay. So next Monday we are discussing bookstagram. And if influences are helpful to your book sales,

Narrator (41m 4s):
If you like what you just heard, there's a few things you can do to support the am. Writing fantasy podcast. Please tell a fellow author about the show and visit us at Apple podcast and leave a rating and review. You can also join Autumn and Jesper on patreon.com/amwritingfantasy for as little as a dollar a month, you'll get awesome rewards and keep the Am Writing Fantasy podcast going. Stay safe out there and see you next Monday.

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